I Don't Have Time: The Shawshank Conundrum

Sep 30

If you’ve ever whispered I don’t have time while drowning in back-to-back sessions, paperwork, and payroll, you’re not alone. The truth is, most clinicians stay stuck in therapist burnout and therapist fatigue, convincing themselves they’ll “figure it out later.” But later never comes.

In this conversation, we unpack the Shawshank Conundrum - the hamster wheel every therapist knows too well - and reveal how to chip away at the walls keeping you trapped in a model that doesn’t serve your life.

This isn’t another pep talk about hustling harder. It’s about naming the reality: trading every hour for dollars will never create the freedom, joy, or sustainability you crave. Whether you’ve Googled jobs for burned out counselors at midnight or secretly wondered about alternative careers for therapists, this episode offers both solidarity and strategy.

What you’ll learn in this episode:

Why the phrase “I don’t have time” is the biggest lie fueling therapist burnout
The hidden cost of staying on the hamster wheel of therapist fatigue (and why most clinicians never escape it)
How carving out non-negotiable CEO time each week is the first step toward alternative careers for therapists
The power of accountability, masterminds, and community when exploring jobs for burned out counselors

This episode will challenge your assumptions about what it means to be a “successful” clinician. You’ll walk away with permission to stop hustling, tools to reclaim your time, and inspiration to explore jobs for burned out counselors and alternative careers for therapists that align with your values.

Ready to stop living in therapist burnout and start carving your way to freedom? Press play now.

WATCH THE FULL VIDEO EPISODE HERE!

[00:00:11] Jennifer Politis: So how many times have you said it? I don't have time. It's the most common sentence I hear from therapists and practice owners who are just running their practice, and I get it. You're on the hamster wheel, back to back clients meetings, all that good stuff, just trying to keep the lights on. The last thing you wanna do at the end of the day is to start digging that little hole behind the poster on the wall.

[00:00:35] Jennifer Politis: But here's the truth, the hole is your way out. It's your Shawshank Redemption moment.

[00:00:41] Colleen Long: Today we're talking about the Shawshank conundrum. Why most therapists never make it out of the grind, and what you can do to start carving out your own path to freedom.

[00:00:50] Jennifer Politis: We've all been there. The calendar's full, the paperwork's piling up, and the last thing you wanna do is chip away at something that won't pay you today.

[00:00:59] Erika Bugaj: But that's the lie. If you never pick up the hammer, you never get out.

[00:01:03] Colleen Long: I can imagine some listeners are like a hole in the wall behind my poster. What? So we're talking about Shawshank Redemption. For anyone that has not seen the movie go see it, but this idea that building our freedom practice. Has to take place in between sessions, after sessions before sessions. So in the movie, Andy Dufrene spends years with nothing but a rock hammer chipping away at that wall behind the poster.

[00:01:33] Colleen Long: It looks insane. And we don't really know what he's doing during the movie. It's slow, it's tedious. It's like not even really making a difference. And we're wondering, what on earth is he working on? Meanwhile, the other prisoners are out in the yard. They're just, they've accepted their fate, they, they're resigned to their reality, and that's what most therapists and clinicians do.

[00:01:57] Colleen Long: They just stay stuck. As a matter of fact, if you're listening to this podcast, you're probably the 20% that aren't cool with just staying stuck and you're in the right place. Most therapists, 80% of the people that will never even listen to this podcast will continue trading every hour for dollars.

[00:02:20] Colleen Long: They'll look at their packed caseload and think there's just no time to build something else maybe in another lifetime. But if you're listening to this, you're not most therapists. You're the apex predator of our field. you already sense that there's a better way and you know your expertise is worth more than those 45 minute blocks that an insurance says is valuable.

[00:02:44] Erika Bugaj: Let's talk about the phrase, I don't have time. When you say that, what you're really saying is it's just not a priority right now, because the reality is if something matters, you carve out the time.

[00:02:58] Erika Bugaj: Just like you do for exercise, just like you do for your kids, just like you do for your relationship or partnership, working on your practice has to get that same level of commitment. Otherwise, you stay in the chair. Forever.

[00:03:14] Colleen Long: Here's the distinction. Doing payroll is not a strategy. So if you're working on the business versus working in the business and you find yourself just doing another 15 to $22 an hour job, then you just create another job for yourself and you're not actually working to scale your practice. Strategy is asking, how do I build retention into my systems?

[00:03:43] Colleen Long: How do I create a scalable model or program or mastermind or retreat? And thinking about if you are younger and you, you're coming into this field, the first half of your. Uh, decade is built, building your clinical skills. It's built, sharpening your skills. It's taking CES and learning from others and getting consultation and becoming seasoned at your craft.

[00:04:17] Colleen Long: But the second half of your practice is about scaling and growing something that can exist without you, and that's what we're talking about today.

[00:04:27] Jennifer Politis: Here's another excuse I often hear. I don't have time to train another me, but do you have time to get back some more time? Imagine training another clinician to replicate not just your clinical skill, but your ability to keep clients, retain them, serve them. That's not wasted time. That's time that pays you back for years moving forward.

[00:04:51] Colleen Long: the idea here is that I think a lot of clinicians, myself included, feel guilty about saying, I wanna get off the chair. And that was a lot of the feedback I got about the title of our podcast was like, I mean, you're talking to people, especially, you know, people that went through these doctoral programs.

[00:05:13] Colleen Long: There are six figures in debt. They spent most of their life training to become this one very specialized professional. And now you're talking about getting off the chair. What are you, what are you looking to do? And what is that for? And when I think about the three things that move the needle for me, and I'm interested in hearing what that is for you guys, but it's time.

[00:05:39] Colleen Long: So more time or it's more money, or it's more joy, right. Like this podcast takes more time. So it's not giving me bad time. It's certainly not giving us money, but it gives me joy and that moves the needle for me. So this is gonna be something that's always worth carving out my week because of that. What about for you guys?

[00:06:02] Colleen Long: What is the thing that moves the needle for you when you decide to get off the chair during your week?

[00:06:10] Jennifer Politis: I mean, I think it's very similar to you. I think I'm looking for more creative passion. I'm looking to be rejuvenated in the field. I think, you know, being in this field for so long, I do think there's like such a heaviness involved that takes a lot out of you. So I think for me, I'm just interested in having more creative pursuits.

[00:06:30] Jennifer Politis: Um, I also think in talking about time, something that I personally did for very long that I, I can't even believe I did. I held onto payroll specifically for a very long time, and even depositing insurance checks, like, just in terms of like thinking like, why did I hold onto that for so long? And I do think there was like a money mindset issue behind some of that, but it was also related to my time.

[00:06:57] Jennifer Politis: Like I felt like nobody else could take that. Away from me.

[00:07:01] Colleen Long: Mm.

[00:07:01] Jennifer Politis: How about you, Erica?

[00:07:03] Erika Bugaj: Yeah, I think it's been a couple years now, but in my work with a coach and mentor, uh, she really encouraged me to reevaluate the number of clients that I was continuing to see as a practice owner and. I think it was serving me and also my own money mindset because, you know, that translated for me, like if I see this number of clients, it results in this amount of money, cash flow, or, you know, adding to the practice finances.

[00:07:37] Erika Bugaj: Uh, but giving that up has definitely opened up more time for me to do other management and administrative tasks in the practice. And I don't think. I don't understand why I've had this kind of robotic mentality of putting myself in the chair as a therapist, which was liberating from a previous job I had, but suddenly I had tunnel vision, or I was just robotically.

[00:08:10] Erika Bugaj: Yes, I'll take another client. Yes, I'll sit here for another hour, you know? Of course I wanna help people and I, I love being a therapist, but in order to really move and shift the practice, I had to give up some of that. I'm still thinking about what causes that kind of mentality. You know, the, the robot or the, you know, just tunnel vision where you can't see beyond or outside of and giving it up is so scary.

[00:08:43] Erika Bugaj: Like, why is that? I, I still, I'm still thinking about it. I still muse about it.

[00:08:48] Colleen Long: Can you unpack that a little bit more? So when you're in that robotic mode, do you mean that it's sort of just driven by like a fear of of money, so if I take on five more clients, I'll be more profitable this quarter? Or is it like, well no, this person needs my help and it's hard for me to say no. Like what keeps kept you stuck in that cycle?

[00:09:12] Erika Bugaj: I think it's a combination of at least those two things that you just mentioned. You know, thinking I'm, I can guarantee the revenue if I'm doing it because I know I can see clients and retain client. I think also just the fear of open space and other things I might be doing with my time, because you don't really know what that's gonna look like when you're just starting.

[00:09:39] Erika Bugaj: So, you know, taking that risk is scary. It's overwhelming. There is fear involved.

[00:09:46] Colleen Long: Yeah. Think about when we decided to do this podcast, right? So it's this nebulous thing. It doesn't exist. You're trying to create something out of nothing. Everybody's busy. You're like, what am what are we doing? Like, is this gonna work? I don't even know how to create a podcast. Is anyone gonna listen? what I have to say even gonna be helpful. And the only thing that I think catapulted this in from nothing into something is it was. Making that first move of throwing a date on the calendar every week and saying, okay, Mondays at 7:00 AM that's when we record. And that's just a non-negotiable, like everybody in my family knows don't come in the office.

[00:10:39] Colleen Long: This is what's happening. It's just, it's in the week now. And that's what we do for everything that's important. Right? Whether it be couples therapy or exercise is, is doing that so. I think that's part of the battle for everyone who's wondering, where would I even start? Is figuring out a non-negotiable time for yourself every week that you're like, this is my hour.

[00:11:08] Colleen Long: Like, no clients are gonna get this hour. No supervisees, no employees. This is my thinking. Time. Um, EOS calls it clarity breaks, and you maybe you go out for a run or whatever, but you're like really thinking about what is that next move for me. So do you think, Erica, because we're all together and now there, there's other people, it was more real for you, like it was it hard for you to get off the chair just for yourself?

[00:11:42] Erika Bugaj: Sure. I think the, that there, the fact that there's a team of us, there's, I think that my cat is on top of my desk here, so, um, that's why I keep looking up. 'cause he, can you see it wobbling? 'cause he's like giving himself a bath up there.

[00:12:02] Colleen Long: Oh my gosh.

[00:12:04] Erika Bugaj: Um. Of course, I think there's power in in numbers and you know, joining with two other folks that have very solid professional backgrounds as therapists and group practice owners, it absolutely gave me more confidence to take this risk. And so I think doing things together. Really can, can be helpful. It can multiply, you know, multiply the good and, um, that's it.

[00:12:39] Erika Bugaj: It has helped to defeat those. You know, we always talk about this as therapists. Those, the negative voices, you know, the, the fears that manifest, um, the thoughts that we may have in response to doing something outside of our comfort zone. Um. I think knowing that we've joined together in this endeavor has bolstered me and given me more confidence to pursue it.

[00:13:08] Erika Bugaj: Um, just standing alone can be really scary.

[00:13:12] Colleen Long: Yeah.

[00:13:13] Jennifer Politis: I agree with that. I think it's uplifting that we do it together and we spend time to even like motivate ourselves and motivate each other to do this

[00:13:22] Jennifer Politis: because I see such amazing things in each of you that, um. Again, as we were, it's all lived experiences, but I just think there's a uniqueness about us seeing each other in our professional roles, but we get to see each other behind the scenes doing this too, and I think we get to just see the best in each other.

[00:13:44] Colleen Long: Yeah, so that's a great point. Um, beyond just carving out the time for yourself, there's a level of accountability that comes with doing it with others, and I'm such a. Gosh, I don't even know what this is. I don't know if this is the Aquarius or whatever, but it's like I'm very independent. I was never good at group projects and in college if like we were assigned a group, I was like, you guys, I'll just do it.

[00:14:18] Colleen Long: Like it was easier for me to just do the thing than to try to talk to someone about doing the thing. But I will say that having two other people as part of this endeavor. Holds me accountable. Like I think there would probably be weeks that would go by that I like wouldn't do anything if it was just me.

[00:14:38] Colleen Long: 'cause who else is, who else cares, right? But now I've got two other people. So I think that's another good takeaway is maybe when you're starting off getting off the chair, it's accountability. It's having some accountability partners and you guys might not even be working towards the same goal somebody might be working on.

[00:14:57] Colleen Long: Writing a a book and somebody else might be working on a podcast and you guys just carve out an hour to co-work together. You're like, what are you gonna do this week? Or what do you have prepared this week?

[00:15:10] Jennifer Politis: I think that's why even mastermind groups have been very helpful for me in the past because it has held me accountable.

[00:15:16] Colleen Long: Yeah. Masterminds are love hate for me. I've been in a lot of 'em, whether it be clinical Masterminds with other clinicians or like I was in Vistage with other CEOs. I was in EO with other entrepreneurs, and it's really hard for me not to compare my insides to everybody outsides, regardless of where I am, you know, like it was.

[00:15:49] Colleen Long: You're sitting next to a CEO of a $700 million corporation. And I feel like at times I was like rolling out my lemonade cart, like, well, okay, let's see, so it's 175 an hour and I could hire this biller and that would get me back an hour. And they're just like, what is this rookie doing? You know? So that was really hard for me in those groups and. In the clinical Masterminds, it was still really hard. One, I think I find in our profession especially, there's like this veneer that everybody feels like they need to put out there of like everyone's good and like the practice is great. I am just so fulfilled and I've got all my time back and all the systems are working and that was like a lot of what was happening during check-ins and like meanwhile, there was me and one other clinician.

[00:16:47] Colleen Long: This clinician like fully, she like fully was severely contemplating the end of her life. She had to stop everything and she was the only one that made me feel normal. I was like, oh, oh my God. Like she's the only one that gets it. Everybody else, I don't know why they're here. They figured it out,

[00:17:08] Jennifer Politis: Well, I think that's the hard thing with the Mastermind is everyone's at a different stage. 'cause I've been, I've been in a few as well, and it really depends on the dynamic right? Of who's in the group, because I've been, I've had, I've had the similar experience as you where I've left them being like, wow, I feel worse about myself.

[00:17:25] Jennifer Politis: Um, but at the same time, I have felt that. Some of them, like you want, I always want someone where they're like a few steps ahead of me, so I feel like I can learn from them. Um, but sometimes the groups aren't set up that way.

[00:17:42] Colleen Long: Yeah. So yeah, I think that's the thing too, is like when you join a mastermind, you almost like need to know if I'm gonna commit this much time and money to it, what are these other people doing? You know? Like if we're just in a different place of life and I've been there where there's like a clinician that's like, so should I do like an S corp?

[00:18:03] Colleen Long: I'm like, oh no, we're talking about like how you should set up tax wise. We're probably not in the right. Like, that was a conversation I had 10 years ago. So, and, and not to make fun of those people. 'cause listen, I was there, we were all there and I understand it, but the moment I start to hear someone ask about whether or not they should be like an S corp or they should still be an LLC, I'm just like, uh, this is a waste of of time.

[00:18:26] Colleen Long: So knowing really quick. What's a good use of your time and what's not is I think important, especially in these mastermind groups.

[00:18:34] Erika Bugaj: I think the last one I was in was a combination of solo practice owners and group practice owners, and there was an a, a bit of resistance, internal resistance I had because I thought, oh, you know, I've done the solo practice, I've expanded, I've grown. Um, but I found it really valuable to hear. A lot of them had worked for group practices before they, you know, hung out their own shingle, and it was helpful to hear their perspectives.

[00:19:04] Erika Bugaj: And I hope that it was also helpful for me to share mine as a group practice owner, because that is a really big disconnect, I think in our, in our industry as some of

[00:19:16] Jennifer Politis: a great point, Erica.

[00:19:17] Erika Bugaj: as some of my, uh. I, I don't know what to call them. My associates, my staff say like, um, they say the industry, which cracks me up to no end.

[00:19:30] Erika Bugaj: Um, but I think there's a great failure to see perspectives, you know, from staff, employee versus. Group practice owner, and you know, to to an extent, there's just absolutely no way for a staff member to sit step into our shoes and understand all those difficult decisions that we make about. Budgeting and finance and the management choices we make and why we might change a policy or procedure, or adjust how we react in a particular situation.

[00:20:10] Erika Bugaj: You know, I feel like, hey, this is my, this is what puts a roof over my kids' heads, and this is what puts food on our table. So if somebody rocks the boat, it's not just, you know. A boat rocking, it's my whole house might be rocking. You know, and I, I don't know that there's a way for therapists that work with us to completely understand that perspective, unless they do it themselves.

[00:20:39] Erika Bugaj: So. I think there is some value in having a diverse group because it, it gives us new perspective about each other and what we're facing and I hope, like when I was a member of this mastermind, I really hope that the advice and insight I was able to provide to some solo practitioners was valuable to them as much as, you know, it was valuable to me to hear what their experiences had been.

[00:21:09] Colleen Long: Mm-hmm. Yeah. It's almost like when you get a babysitter, if they're a parent, you're like solid. You know, because they're like, I get it. Like get 'em in bed, like make 'em fed. Make your house clean. Don't leave dishes in there. You get a teenager that's never been a parent. And they're like, yeah, they went to bed at like seven.

[00:21:28] Colleen Long: I just like hung out on TikTok and then your whole sink is full. You know? And you're just like, what? When you have a, someone that comes to work for you and they've owned a group practice before, that is golden. 'cause they're like, I don't wanna do what you're doing. Like thank you by the way. And happy to work for you don't wanna deal with any of the admin, but thank you for doing that.

[00:21:50] Colleen Long: You know, a totally different vibe, Erica, to the level of your comfort. I want you to share what you're talking about this morning because what you're dealing with is something I dealt with, something Jen's dealt with, what a lot of group practice owners have dealt with, uh, which is. Not always the fun aspects of employing people, and I just, you just made such a great point about you can't always have all your eggs in one basket and the need for getting off the chair like this can't hold so much power in your life, especially if you're contracted with insurance companies.

[00:22:36] Colleen Long: My God. This will create so many sleepless nights if these are the only eggs in your basket. So to your level of comfortable comfort, if you wanna share kind of what you were talking about.

[00:22:47] Erika Bugaj: Yeah, I, you mean when I was talking about staff turnover?

[00:22:51] Colleen Long: Mm-hmm.

[00:22:52] Erika Bugaj: Sure. I think, my perspective on that is that I have staff members that occasionally resign and leave to. Presumably greener pastures, and that's fine. I try to be supportive. My entire goal as the group practice owner is to make that transition as smooth as possible because I have this group of people that I've assembled who are, you know, seeing clients in the community providing.

[00:23:22] Erika Bugaj: Really good therapy services and support. I'm mentoring them. I'm supervising them. I'm pouring myself into them, and then those who decide to leave have made a decision that this is no longer for them. On some level for a personal reason, for a professional reason because they can't align with the framework that I've provided and put into their offer letter.

[00:23:50] Erika Bugaj: You know, there can be so many good reasons for that. I was an employee, I left jobs, but I don't always see the respect and appreciation for the disruption. And sometimes I think that. You know, there's just a. Some blind spots about how a departure can affect a group practice, and I'm the only one looking out for the practice, and I have said that in recent times.

[00:24:21] Erika Bugaj: Hey, you're making the choice that's best for you and you're leaving and I'm supporting you to make that departure and transition. However, I am the only one looking out for this practice and I mean, subtext. I'm the only one looking out for my small business. I'm the only one looking out for the general financial wellbeing and wholeness of the practice.

[00:24:46] Erika Bugaj: And, you know, much further down the, the list of priorities I'm looking out for, making sure I can cover my monthly bills for my family. You know, um, there's just, I just read recently. Maybe this weekend, like being a business owner is something you think about 24 7. And I have moments of like, Hey, let me go take a job, because then I go, I clock in, I do the job, and I think you've said this, Colleen.

[00:25:15] Erika Bugaj: I put in my time and then I can go home and think about. The new Netflix show, I wanna binge and I can think about my gardening hobby and my pets, and the next weekend getaway. I wanna plan with my children. But when you're a, you're a business owner, you think about the business all the time, there's never a break even on vacation,

[00:25:41] Colleen Long: Mm-hmm.

[00:25:43] Erika Bugaj: you know?

[00:25:44] Erika Bugaj: So I hope that, you know, it was what. You were looking for in terms of me speaking

[00:25:50] Colleen Long: Yeah. It is perfect. Uh, you just. me, it felt like it's such a healthy place to go because your, your first thought was, I'm so grateful for this podcast because now there's so many other paths that I can go like this doesn't have to be the, the grind, and that is the freedom. Of getting off the chair is, it doesn't have to be the model that you thought in grad school it was gonna look like.

[00:26:25] Colleen Long: And I mean, I got news for you. Even if you're off insurance panels, and let's say you're crushing it and you're taking in 300 an hour, you're still capped. So how do you build for scale One, how do you build a practice that can grow without you? And that means sometimes. You're gonna have to take that time to train people to be like you because there's only one you and you're really good at a thing, but there's only so much of you to go around.

[00:26:54] Colleen Long: And if you're that good, isn't it a incumbent upon you to teach other people how to do that? To get that word out to more people versus just the lucky few that get in your seat four to six hours a day.

[00:27:08] Erika Bugaj: Lucky. I am grateful for, you know, my practice and the team and community that I've built there. And I also feel a need to protect it. So, you know, that inevitably comes up, but it's also interesting. Listening to you saying that, like having a job in a social service agency. That was my vision when I was in grad school.

[00:27:40] Erika Bugaj: And then for me, like opening a practice, woo, that was like a big vision, you know, like really taking a risk. But so to even have the courage or, you know, vision to go even beyond that.

[00:27:58] Colleen Long: Yeah.

[00:28:01] Erika Bugaj: like mind blowing. You know,

[00:28:05] Colleen Long: Yeah, and we're in an interesting, uh, generation, so I don't, I still don't know what I am. I don't know if I'm a Gen X or a millennial. I was born in 1980, so

[00:28:18] Erika Bugaj: you're in that little, there's this, there's a micro generation there that's like. 78 to 82 or something that's like kind of in between Gen X

[00:28:30] Colleen Long: Yeah.

[00:28:31] Erika Bugaj: millennial. I forget what they're called, but they, they

[00:28:35] Colleen Long: There's a word for an elder millennial. That's what I would be.

[00:28:39] Jennifer Politis: That's what I am too. I'm 80.

[00:28:42] Colleen Long: Yeah. So like we have an interesting generation because at in 91 I was 11, and I remember the internet coming out, the a OL dial up and just being like, what is this? You know? And. Uh, morays Law, if you look at that, like how technology, like the printing press, how it ex like, just, um, exponentially grew a society because of the printing press.

[00:29:12] Colleen Long: Well then if that's one x it was 10 x. When the internet came out and now with AI it's gonna be like a hundred x. So it's wild. All the possibilities and things that you can do now. I mean, first off, like if you're not even like thinking about how technology can leverage technology and your expertise to get off the chair, like what are you even doing?

[00:29:30] Colleen Long: You're on the wrong podcast. 'cause like this is like the time that we live in and unfortunately I think the generation right before us, and I know like my mom's generation, they've got a really hard work ethic, but. They weren't exposed to the technology in the way that, like, now when they're trying to learn it, it's like, ah, I just, there's an averse. To it. And that can be hard if you're gonna thrive off the chair. Whereas for us, like while we might not like know, like float right into TikTok and have like a GoPro on our shoulder when we wake up in the morning, like the Gen Zs, we can adapt. Like I'm open to it. I like figuring it out. And so I think that's a powerful place to be in in 2025.

[00:30:19] Colleen Long: Is. To be just open enough to seeing what are the tools that we have at our fingertips right now that can really sort of leverage your time and in a big, impactful way,

[00:30:32] Erika Bugaj: Yeah, by the way, I looked it up and the microgeneration is surprisingly called Xen.

[00:30:40] Jennifer Politis: Oh wow.

[00:30:42] Erika Bugaj: So, um, 1977 to 1983 centennials are described as having had an analog childhood and a digital young adulthood. Um,

[00:30:54] Colleen Long: I love that. It's true,

[00:30:58] Erika Bugaj: pre pretty like

[00:30:59] Colleen Long: I mean, I played with Lincoln Logs as a kid, you know, very analog,

[00:31:02] Erika Bugaj: yes,

[00:31:03] Colleen Long: light brights.

[00:31:04] Erika Bugaj: same.

[00:31:06] Colleen Long: Yeah. Um, so. Jen, when we're talking about this and we're talking about, you know, getting off the chair and, um, you know, building something that can grow without you, whether or not you're a group practice owner or you're building an Etsy shop, right?

[00:31:27] Colleen Long: That's making money while you sleep, something that doesn't require you to be in the chair hour for hour. What comes up for you? Where is your head space at right now?

[00:31:40] Jennifer Politis: For me, I'm definitely looking to expand and get out of this seat even further. I do think in retrospect, I created the group practice to get out of the chair. I didn't know that at the time though. Yes, of course we wanted, I wanted to help more people, but like in looking back at just all the dynamics at play, I think that was just a way to not feel as burnt out and see so many clients was to, um, obviously open a group practice.

[00:32:10] Jennifer Politis: But now as I look at it, I really don't know, and it's kind of liberating to not know what's next. I'm interested in just learning more about AI and, and other things, but. I don't really know, and I think that's okay for where I'm at right now. You know, I'm definitely chasing some more freedom and more creativity and more joy, so I don't know where that's gonna lead me.

[00:32:36] Colleen Long: Yeah, I, I feel like there's just like this, gosh, this time that we live in, I'm, I'm just so excited about it. There's so much possibility and you can get paralyzed. By the amount of possibility. I know. I

[00:32:55] Jennifer Politis: Yeah, and that's probably honestly where I am. That's probably what's happening with me right now. Because, and I grew up in the same generation of you, it's like work really hard. It's gonna pay off X, Y, and Z. So like I'm trying to change that frame of reference for myself of like, okay, we're not gonna do that anymore, which is kind of hard for me to do.

[00:33:14] Jennifer Politis: I'm not gonna lie. I can easily gimme a project, I'll jump back into something. Or, Hey, you wanna create another business? I'm there. So I'm actually trying to kind of brace myself and like hit pause a lot more than I used to in order to figure out what's next.

[00:33:28] Colleen Long: Yeah. This newer generation, I mean, say what you will. Right? And we've all had our headaches trying to fit a square into a round hole with the newer generation. but. the Thing that I think is such a breath of fresh air is they're just like, I don't know, like really know if I want to make a ton of money. I mean, eventually they're gonna have to figure out how to pay their mortgage or I don't know any, if anyone will ever be able to have a mortgage again. But like their whole value system has changed. And maybe that's, something after the pandemic. But I do think. We're in this crazy period of time that they'll probably look back in history books and be like, there was a whole generation of people that were still like clocking in and clocking out.

[00:34:22] Colleen Long: And then at simultaneously, there was this new generation that was coming in that was like, I just made what you made last month in an hour on my YouTube because I knew how to leverage technology. So, uh, I think if you're not. At least looking at what's going on out there, you're missing out.

[00:34:45] Jennifer Politis: Yeah, I agree with that.

[00:34:46] Colleen Long: Um, and you know, it's a freedom that, I guess like what you said this morning, Erica just hit so hard because I went through, uh, pretty intense, uh, just hard dark times last year, you know. In my practice, when we went through the change healthcare breach, we didn't know when we were gonna get paid again. Clinicians started leaving, and as always, it's never the insurance company that people join in with you and go, God, that sucks. It's you. You become the vicarious person to take it on the chin. And so as the change healthcare breach was happening and money's not coming in, I remember the blank stares looking at me going, guys, I don't know where this money's gonna come from.

[00:35:45] Colleen Long: Like it, they're not paying us right now. And I just remember almost like you were saying, Erica, this robotic, there was no room in my head for cuing. There's something. There's a better way. You don't have to like grind it through this way. Group practice isn't the only way you can create freedom for yourself.

[00:36:12] Colleen Long: And there are plenty of people that do it and do it just fine. But I was so tightly wound and attached to this thing that I thought was the only alternative. And there's so many other alternatives out there, especially if you have all this training under your belt that. I think it's paramount that you are taking at least a couple hours a week away from the chair and you are either training your successors.

[00:36:47] Colleen Long: You are taking those people that you can see are hard workers and they wanna learn and they're in your practice and you're taking them under your wing and you're like, Hey, you're really good at managing people. I'm gonna have you run the next clinical meeting, or You're great with numbers. Can you run all of our testing inventory?

[00:37:06] Colleen Long: Would you wanna do that? Would you wanna learn how to do that? And that delegation isn't about just throwing it or passing the buck onto someone else. It's about. Investment in those around you, investment in them to grow in a way that's gonna grow your legacy for whatever you're doing. But taking that time is gonna take away money.

[00:37:28] Colleen Long: and that's the exactly the reason why you have to get off the chair, because you can't fear those hours, taking those hours away, those hours. Are gonna be worth so much more to you than what any one client could pay.

[00:37:41] Erika Bugaj: And again, I think that goes back to taking the risk, but having people who are aligned with you in navigating that together like we are with this podcast.

[00:37:55] Colleen Long: Yeah, for sure. I think it definitely helps having. Even like a biz bestie. Um, Amber, gosh, her name's Amber and she's a coach. Amber Holly, I think is her name. She's great. And, um, she talks a lot about the biz bestie and how important it is to have it. Having someone that they don't necessarily have to think like you, but maybe they struggle with some of the same pain points that you do on a daily basis.

[00:38:26] Colleen Long: And as we all know, as therapists, a problem share is a problem have, so if you have that biz bestie that you are checking in with once a week and you're like, what are you working on? And they're like, girl, I haven't done anything. I'm just gonna go do groceries. Great. That's what you've chosen to do with your time.

[00:38:43] Colleen Long: You can hire an Instacart person at, you know, $15 an hour to go do that for you, and then you can build something really worth your time or you can choose to get groceries or, or whatever. So. Um, that other piece, reaching out and finding somebody that's an accountability partner is so helpful and for all entrepreneurs.

[00:39:05] Colleen Long: I think the hardest part is working on something that maybe is putting no dollars in your pocket right now and, and fervently believing in it when everybody else is like, ed, what are you doing? You went to school for all those years and you're doing what?

[00:39:22] Jennifer Politis: So here's the question. Are you going to stay on the hamster wheel or are you going to carve out time to dig your way out of freedom? The walls right in front of you, the posters there, the path exists. All you have to do is pick up the hammer and start.

[00:39:38] Erika Bugaj: I like the hamster wheel comment definitely was what I was trying to say. Like, I'm on a hamster wheel. Why can I not get off of it? Why do I see this as the only thing ahead of me, you

[00:39:52] Colleen Long: Why am I a hamster? Why am I thinking like a hamster?

[00:39:58] Colleen Long: Most therapists will never get out of Shawshank, but you don't have to be Most therapist.

[00:40:03] Jennifer Politis: Carve out the time. Commit to yourself, your practice, and your freedom.

[00:40:08] Erika Bugaj: And if you're ready to pick up the hammer, join us in the Founder's Membership and Class of 2026 Mastermind. The posters on the wall, the path is there. The question is, are you walking through it?

[00:40:21] Colleen Long: Yeah, so we are starting our first ever founder's membership and eventually we'll be enrolling in our first ever class of 2026 Mastermind. How will this be different than every other mastermind or membership that you've been in, that you've tried to find that freedom? Well, I'm gonna tell you because we've all been in the wrong masterminds and founder groups, and we wanna make sure that we curate it, especially for each person in there.

[00:40:50] Colleen Long: And I think the unique. Benefit that we have as therapists is that we know how to check in with our clients and say, is this working for you? Are you feeling a change in your life as the result of our work together? And that translates on a larger scale to what we'll be building in the initial founder circle, as well as the Mastermind is making sure that when you're in there, we don't just go, okay, John attended this week, great, but that John was fully engaged and felt like that was the most impactful hour of his week. Um, I'm getting ready to go to this Women's Venture Summit in San Diego this week, and I love conferences. I just love, I think I love learning, but God, this thing is so freaking fun. Like I leave this floating, I leave this conference floating. The women are bad asses. Some of them are like. Multi multimillionaire investors that are now there looking to give back to founders.

[00:42:01] Colleen Long: And it is so incredible and not in like a cheesy, like you can do it sister, but like a. Empowering, like, fuck yeah. And let's figure this out. And so that's what we're building here with ours, is that every single person in the group is gonna be like, you guys, I want what you have. I want this freedom. I don't know what the hell that looks like for me, but I do know I need to carve out an hour to just talking about that.

[00:42:30] Colleen Long: That's what this is for. So, um. We will have a signup link in our Instagram, head to our Instagram if you're looking for that. And, uh, it'll be in the show notes as well.

[00:42:41] Erika Bugaj: A quote just came to mind as you were talking, Colleen and. It was, it is leap and the net will appear.

[00:42:50] Colleen Long: Yes.

[00:42:52] Jennifer Politis: Oh, I love it. seems like what we're doing and what we're hoping to spark up in other people.

[00:42:57] Colleen Long: The thing I used to find myself repeating the most, and I don't remember what book I picked this stuff out of, but it's not my original content, was people will come and say that they want something different. They want change. They'll say, I'm just waiting on all my ducks to get in a row first. And if you've actually ever watched ducks get in a row, it takes the mother goose taking the first step. She gets up and then the ducks get in a row, right? So taking that first step, whether that be joining our, our founder circle, the Mastermind, or just simply carving out an hour for yourself during the week, that's the first step. And you'll watch your ducks get in a row. You'll watch your priorities change as you start to take those first steps. All right, guys. Well. The wall's right in front of you, the poster's there, the path exists. All you have to do is pick up the hammer and start.

Off the Chair Podcast

I Don't Have Time: The Shawshank Conundrum

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Colleen Long, Psy.D.

Jennifer Politis, PhD, LPC

Erika Bugaj, MA, MSW, LICSW

Episode Transcript:

Retreats, Rest & Revenue: The Dual Life of a Clinician-Entrepreneur