The Realities of Being a Mom Boss

Sep 2

Being a mom therapist means wearing more hats than most people can imagine - and switching between them in the blink of an eye.

In this raw and real episode, we talk candidly about balancing motherhood and career, and how we manage the mental load without completely burning out.

We dig deep into the lived experience of being a mom therapist in today’s “do it all” culture - and we don’t hold back. From awkward Zoom calls with kids in the background to the cost (financial and emotional) of showing up at your kid’s 10am school play, this is what balancing motherhood and career actually looks like behind the scenes.

We talk about:

The crushing mental load of modern motherhood - and how working mom burnout sneaks in, even when you love your job
The real cost of that school play (yep, we calculated it) - and why it’s so hard for a mom therapist to make time for both clients and class parties
What “identity whiplash” feels like when you're code-switching between CEO, clinician, and carpool driver
Creative ways we’re redefining “quality time” with our kids without sacrificing the businesses we’ve built
How we recognize the signs of therapist burnout - and the micro-adjustments we make to protect our energy and our kids

Whether you're crying in your car between sessions or building your dream mental health business after bedtime, this episode will make you feel seen, supported, and a little less alone.

WATCH THE FULL VIDEO EPISODE HERE!

[00:00:11] Colleen Long: So today we're talking about all things moms and being a group practice owner slash therapist slash entrepreneur, all the mental load that goes with that. And, um. You know, I, I don't think that this episode has to be just for moms either. I think it can be for dads too. I mean, dads certainly these days carry so much more than I solved dads in the past for sure.

[00:00:40] Colleen Long: and so it's meant to be, I think more just a nod to the general mental load that we carry as parents and as practice owners and just the unique burnout that takes place when you're constantly. Trading your time for money with, with people. Right. And you're serving them and then you're serving your family on the outside and, and where is that break for you?

[00:01:04] Colleen Long: Throughout the day?

[00:01:05] Erika Bugaj: I am still coming to. Consciousness after first day of school drop off. I've got my, my big mug of coffee here.

[00:01:16] Colleen Long: Great segue. This is a real life example, right?

[00:01:23] Erika Bugaj: Yeah, I mean that was the focus this morning was, you know, getting lunches packed and everybody in their back to school outfits and gotta snap those pictures before we get in the car. And, um, I dropped one off. Middle school and went off at elementary school, um, braved the packed playground to find the fifth grade line.

[00:01:50] Erika Bugaj: And here I am at my office.

[00:01:53] Colleen Long: and what you're experiencing right now is a reality of what we do every day, which is this like code switching. I think that's what they call it. It's like you're, you're in mom mode and it's an entirely different area of the brain. You're trying to be present. You're, it's this ex instinctual place of like, nurturing, caring, making sure your kids are safe and, and their wellbeing's good.

[00:02:22] Colleen Long: So you're like in this place that uses a different part of the brain and then you're coming into this podcast, which is something that you're trying to do for yourself, for your business, and you've gotta have this like cohesive presentation for people, right? Where you're. I'm trying to wrap up what this thing is, and I find myself doing that all day long.

[00:02:47] Colleen Long: This code switching now even more so since we work from home post COVID is like, I'll be looking at a p and l and it's not the funnest thing in the world. And you're like, where is that? And why is it like that? And then I've got my son that comes in and he's like, mom, is it true everything's bigger in Texas? Mom, can you just real quick tell me about crypto just real quick? You know, and you're, and you're trying to not, and you're constantly feeling guilty because I always think of that Maya Angelou quote that the best gift a parent can give their child is to watch their faces light up when they enter the room.

[00:03:34] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:03:35] Colleen Long: I always like try to do that. When my kids come in the room, it's like, oh, hi, hey. But it's so hard because you're just, your mind, your mind is running a mile a minute all day long, and you wanna, you want them to feel important, but it's, it's too much.

[00:03:51] Jennifer Politis: I call that identity whiplash. Because I feel like one day or one morning, you know, you have your, uh, clinic, you're in clinician mode, maybe you're seeing clients, and then by lunch you're in CEO mode and you're in meetings. And then at 3:00 PM you're in the pickup line and you're in mom mode. And although, you know, it's very jarring, it, it really is to like switch from one to another.

[00:04:15] Jennifer Politis: And I know we get better at it as time goes on, but I think the skills definitely overlap. But they definitely clash. You know, clinician mode, you're trying to be empathetic and present and CEO mode. You're trying to be decisive and you're trying to delegate, and then mom mode, you're trying to nurture and stay calm and everyone's melting down, but the switching of hats is exhausting.

[00:04:38] Colleen Long: absolutely.

[00:04:40] Erika Bugaj: Yeah, that's what I was just talking about in terms of the. You know, getting the kids to school hat, and now I'm here with the podcast hat on my head, a new one.

[00:04:52] Colleen Long: Yeah. And when you look at what we do as therapists, uh, the unique piece about our field is that. If you are still in that grind of seeing 25 to 30 patients a week, you're not getting anything else done. You're not, you know, anybody else that works 40 hours a week. There's a moment where they go into their office and they sip a hot coffee all the way through and they can get back to an email.

[00:05:30] Colleen Long: They can schedule their kids' dentist appointment. There is none of that when you're in session. You are fully and completely attended to that patient, right? And so those 30 hours are gone, and I think that is now more than ever why it's so important for us to figure out how to get off the chair in that sense, right?

[00:05:57] Colleen Long: At at least partially, how do you make money? How do you leverage your expertise in a way that you can make money? While you're at your kids' school show that apparently everybody likes to do at 10:00 AM now in the middle of a work day.

[00:06:13] Erika Bugaj: Right. I felt like I was winning this year because I carefully looked at the school newsletters to find the back to school night times to, to. Carve those out, make sure they were in my calendar so that I didn't double book myself because that's been historical. Something that I've done is double book a client or a work event or something else with back to school night.

[00:06:40] Erika Bugaj: And ultimately back to school night needs to win, right? But it can be tough to keep track of so many different schedules. And particularly when you are seeing clients, like you're saying, Colleen, back to back, there's hardly five minutes to take a breath, take a sip of water,

[00:07:00] Colleen Long: Mm-hmm.

[00:07:01] Erika Bugaj: you know, take a small break and then, you know, check in on potentially any phone calls or voicemails or emails you've missed related to what's happening with your kids.

[00:07:16] Colleen Long: Well, and I'm just thinking about, you know, we've got a book fair this week, and so of course they want all the parents to take a shift and I wanna take a shift. I want. My kids to have that moment where they walk into their library and they see me there and they're like, oh my God, my mom's here.

[00:07:36] Colleen Long: And I wanted that so badly when I was a kid and I just didn't have the benefit of that. 'cause my mom was a single mom and she couldn't just stop working. Um, but those things take time. And there's a unique piece of when you work for yourself as a therapist, and if you are still trading that time for money, let's say on average you get $150 an hour.

[00:08:00] Colleen Long: Then if I have to go to my kids' school play from 10 to 12 to learn about the history of California, um, I gotta get there and I gotta come back. So that's three hours that play costs me $450. Right? And so thinking about it in those terms, it's even more imperative. That when you are a mom, especially in the season of life, if your kids are younger and they need more engagement to figure out how to build a freedom practice that doesn't require you to be in that chair all the time. I guess I would ask you guys. I mean, we're all sort of that entrepreneur type. And I don't know if this happens for you all, but I get ideas like at a hypomanic level pretty much every day about things I wanna do. And fortunately I act on a lot of them. Um, and so I think for the longest time I felt like. I'll just get everything all set with my practice. Like I'll just make sure that the flywheel is created and that we've got this good system in place, and then I'll get to all these creative pursuits that I wanna do. And the reality is I woke up at 45 and was like, I haven't done any of the things that I've wanted to do.

[00:09:28] Colleen Long: I've done everything that I have had to do. And so. What it looked like for me for a long time in carving out these areas of passive income streams is a lot like if you guys seen that movie Shan Redemption, where Andy is like, he's carving out that little hold of freedom behind the poster every day, and he just works on it a little bit every day. I felt like to carve out these little paths of freedom for ourselves as moms or even single parents. Um, and you're running a practice and you're seeing, you know, 25 to 30 patients a week. How do you break free from that? How do you at least get off the chair?

[00:10:14] Colleen Long: Partially, and it's a lot like that analogy in Shawshank Redemption, where Andy's, he's slowly carving that hole over time. That's what I found myself doing, which was I would naturally gravitate towards these things I love to do anyways, which is the social media, the creative stuff, the Etsy passive income products, the uh, writing, creative writing.

[00:10:39] Colleen Long: And you just have to do it. And they talk about eating the frogs first. It's like first thing in the morning. That's when my brain is the quickest, the freshest. And those are the moments where I could just buzz through and finish a bunch of bunch of reports. But I'm gonna take that time to do those Hail Marys, those things that maybe don't even feel like they're making a drop on the bucket right now.

[00:11:05] Colleen Long: But like this podcast. It's all about reps for us, right? And we're talking into the ephe. We, we don't know. They're probably my mom's listening and that's about it. But that's where it starts, right? You just keep on doing it until it becomes old hat. And so I think that's, at least in my experience, has been really hard to.

[00:11:30] Colleen Long: Do those things for yourself. Carve out that little freedom path when no one else sees it. Nobody else would feel it if you stopped doing it. And your life is really about serving your clients and then serving your family.

[00:11:43] Jennifer Politis: I think a big part of being a mom is the invisible load that we all carry, right? There's such a heavy load of remembering all those invisible tasks, such as like schedules and birthdays and homework deadlines and sports and doctor's appointments, right? I'm sure you guys feel that all the time.

[00:12:04] Colleen Long: Oh, the level of dings. I just have to turn, do not disturb on during the day because you've got bloom talk points. Team snap game changer. You've got ding, ding, ding all day long. And for me with three kids and some in two different activities, and then you have a constant text thread all day long where they're like, I'll bring this.

[00:12:30] Colleen Long: We should get this teacher, this thing we should do. And. As involved as my husband is, God bless him, he's not dealing with Venmo and trying to get the teacher's gifts and it's teacher appreciation week and you gotta drop off lunch and all of that. And so there's just such level of decision fatigue and code switching, what did you call it?

[00:12:54] Colleen Long: Gin. It's like the bandwidth you have to

[00:12:56] Jennifer Politis: Yeah, it's like identity whiplash. I feel like you're like putting on a different hat. Yeah.

[00:13:02] Colleen Long: yes. And you're, it's just, uh, it's maddening. I feel like in the eighties, parents just like went to work and they, there was no like text thread game snap. You just literally like went to your kid's school. I don't even know that my parents knew where my school was, you know, or like who my teacher was or what grade I was in.

[00:13:24] Colleen Long: Literally, I took a bus, went and came back, and like now it's just such. A child-centric culture that we live in. I think we're trying to compensate for the wrongs of the past and we love this, but there's gotta be a cultural correction here soon because this is like too much. I,

[00:13:46] Jennifer Politis: It is way

[00:13:46] Jennifer Politis: too much and we're not giving kids, I think ultimately the independence they need and deserve to thrive. I find like you have that other end of the spectrum where some parents are so over involved in every aspect for their kids, that you're not giving them space to grow and skin their knee and get back up again on their own.

[00:14:05] Jennifer Politis: Like we're here as parents, of course, we're always here and we wanna be present, but we don't have to be hovering.

[00:14:11] Colleen Long: Right.

[00:14:12] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:14:13] Colleen Long: And I think we have to let go of the idea that our kids are going to emerge unscathed as adults in their therapy session. They're gonna talk about something that we did wrong. There's just no getting around that.

[00:14:28] Jennifer Politis: hundred percent. I feel like we all know that's gonna happen. I feel like right as therapists, I feel like we're like, okay, we know, you know, every, it's almost like horrible the amount of stuff we know. It almost like makes us probably worry more so about our kids. 'cause we know that like X, Y, and Z can happen.

[00:14:46] Jennifer Politis: But then on the flip side, you kind of release, I feel like I release. It's like, okay, everyone's gonna end up, you know, if people, if all my kids end up in therapy, they end up in therapy. It is what it is. Right.

[00:14:56] Colleen Long: Well, and that's such a great attitude. I've only come to that conclusion recently, which is like, I think of that Maria Schreiber quote where she says, you can have it all. You just can't have it all at the same time.

[00:15:10] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:15:13] Colleen Long: mean, I'm only now, you know, four. I'm at 45 and I'm just now realizing you simply cannot have it all.

[00:15:23] Colleen Long: Like, you cannot, you cannot be a balanced, present mom and then be an a, a leader of a company and live in Orange County, California, where it's not cheap and you've gotta pay a mortgage and all of the other stuff that comes with it. And so, uh. am really struggling with trying to give myself grace and figuring out how to choose my hard.

[00:15:52] Colleen Long: Something's gonna be hard, something's gotta give. So like what is that gonna be?

[00:15:55] Erika Bugaj: Yeah, I feel similarly in the, you know, DC metropolitan area where I live. Um, there are a lot of demands on us as professionals and then also, you know, on our kids to kind of. Perform in the way that the schools want them to and to keep up with all the activities and sports. And you know, of course we want to see them be well-rounded people.

[00:16:24] Erika Bugaj: I also have had the experience here that parents schedule their kids in therapy, like another additional afterschool activity.

[00:16:32] Colleen Long: Mm-hmm.

[00:16:33] Jennifer Politis: Yep.

[00:16:33] Erika Bugaj: Um, I mean, and in therapy, you know, we can look at it from the viewpoint of. Like mental health, maintenance and support, right? Like, it's good for all of us. but it's so interesting how it's kind of, uh, scheduled like another, like Monday you have soccer.

[00:16:52] Erika Bugaj: Tuesday you have debate club, and Wednesday you have therapy.

[00:16:56] Colleen Long: Mm-hmm.

[00:16:58] Erika Bugaj: You know, um, it, it's a different kind of making sure your kid is in like. Good, hands taken care of, well taken care of, and supported and being developed on in all the ways that you want to see them developed. Um, just something I've noticed here in dc.

[00:17:20] Colleen Long: Well, and I'll say my boys fight like. Mortal Kom, they just are. I mean, at this point, sibling rivalry is an understatement. And of course, as a therapist I go, alright, well I'm gonna just do some couples therapy with them and I'll like, you know, carve out the time. So then you become the therapist then for your child too, because you're like, well, I know how to do this.

[00:17:46] Colleen Long: I'm not gonna outsource it to someone. I'm just gonna, we'll talk about emotional regulation and green zones and all that kind of, and then I'm like, no, I'm not gonna be my kid's therapist, but. You know, if, if I don't take the time to make sure that they're working on their relationship, it's only harder for me later because it's all day long of refereeing.

[00:18:09] Colleen Long: And so, um, I, I have found, and even when I'm working with parents, they're like. Like everything sounds really good. We're like, you should use this tool called Mightier and Endeavor. And they're like, great, great. But like, when do you do that? So you do kind of have to schedule and carve out these moments.

[00:18:28] Colleen Long: And for the boys, I mean, I joke, but they literally are in couples therapy and there's a therapist that works with them. And every Wednesday morning at 8:00 AM they're on there. And I make them prepare and they're, you know, ready to go. And they hate it. They don't wanna keep on going. But I'm like, then get along better and we'll stop.

[00:18:49] Colleen Long: But again, another thing that I'm facilitating, you know, I'm in there going, alright guys, let's take 10 minutes before therapy and think about what we're gonna talk about in therapy. Let's not waste the first 20 minutes trying to remember what we wanted to talk about and like, what did we work on last time?

[00:19:04] Colleen Long: You know? So like you're just constantly on in everything.

[00:19:09] Jennifer Politis: are constantly on your, your mind is never off. And honestly, even comparing it to our practices. There's, there's still an invisible load there as well that goes on, like remembering all the little minutia of what goes on. When are the staff anniversaries? Your mind is always going. You're like, wait a second, did I pay that bill?

[00:19:29] Jennifer Politis: Wait, what happened with this? Oh, I have this great idea. So they're very similar. It's like that, you know, the invisible load of being a business owner, but it's also being a mom.

[00:19:38] Colleen Long: Yeah, and I feel like there's moms that they truly, they're calling when they have kids. They're like. I don't wanna work. Like I, I do not, I would be upset if I was working. I want to be with them a hundred percent and I don't fault them for that. I, I, I think that's amazing. And if that's what they're wanting to do now it's different if someone's like, oh, I don't wanna work, so I'll like, stay home with the kids.

[00:20:06] Colleen Long: That's different. But I know, I know moms personally, who they're just like, I'll figure out work later. Like, I really want this time to be with the kids. I think that's awesome. I don't have that mommy mom in me. Unfortunately. I wanted to be that mommy mom. I wanted to be like in the carpool line, like, do you want guys wanna make cookies?

[00:20:29] Colleen Long: But I, I can't. I literally, like, I'm, I try to be present and then I find myself like thinking about a new idea and jotting it down and like, what do you guys. Where, where have you guys come to terms with, in terms of the type of mom you are?

[00:20:48] Erika Bugaj: Well, I think we probably all know the good enough mother theory that we don't have to be perfect. We just need to be good enough. So I don't know that it's constant. Protracted attention and intensity with kids as much as it is, you know, having those really good bonding moments when they come up or when you can have the time to do it.

[00:21:15] Erika Bugaj: And those are like transitional objects for our kids. They can take those forward, um, into their days all day and, you know. Think back to those moments when they're maybe stressed or, you know, missing us and think, oh, I have a good mom. She's shows up for me when I need her. But I think the reality is no one can be a hundred percent on all the time for their children.

[00:21:43] Erika Bugaj: And you know, another anecdote from this morning as I'm walking my son up. To school. I'm, you know, sensing he's a little bit nervous and we're about to walk into this, you know, mass of people and find his teacher. So I was, you know, reminding him of how. A couple weeks ago we floated down a river on tubes together.

[00:22:06] Erika Bugaj: And you know, I was giving him those sensory and mindfulness cues, um, how relaxing it was and how much fun we had together. And he's like, mom, you're so weird. And I'm like, okay, yeah, I'm weird. I, I accept it. And then I just kind of clammed up, you know, because apparently he needed some quiet in that moment and I can respect that. But, um, you know, I've really hung up. He's 10. Um, so, you know, I think we, we have a lot of tools up our sleeves from being therapists that we wanna offer, but.

[00:22:50] Erika Bugaj: You know, the, the, our children have to be willing to follow us down that path together.

[00:22:57] Colleen Long: Yeah.

[00:22:58] Jennifer Politis: I think sometimes they actually really, I'm sure there's other opportunities where, you know, of course they don't want you to say something Thera, you know, put your therapist hat on. But then on the flip side, they do probably come to you, Erica, or your son will come to you when he's feeling a certain way, knowing he's gonna get that out of you.

[00:23:16] Jennifer Politis: Therapist mom.

[00:23:17] Erika Bugaj: Yeah, I think so. Um, that they know I'm a therapist and you know, I think they, I, I can tell they appreciate the emotional connection, the, that they can have with me. But, you know, I think for me it's important to give that to them on their terms, like when they're seeking it, be available and, you know, okay, so we don't wanna take a walk.

[00:23:42] Erika Bugaj: Down memory lane today and think about our fun bonding moment on the river. But you know, there will be another time that he'll, he'll bring that up and be like, huh. That was an interesting experience we had.

[00:23:55] Colleen Long: So it's just meeting him where he is at. You know, it's like, yeah, he had a, probably, he was doing a, a brain rot. Have you guys heard of that game yet?

[00:24:04] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:24:05] Colleen Long: It's, it's literally brain rot. Oh my God. It's just, it's wild. My kids are screaming. I got a Coca Fonte, Belafonte. I don't even know what it is. And that'll be a whole other episode.

[00:24:18] Colleen Long: Right? It's just screens and the battles that we have with that. But. It's, uh, you know, I think, like you said, it, it, Erica, it's like you want to connect and bond with your kids, but it's also like the timing of being able to meet them when they're ready to connect and bond, which doesn't always line up sometimes.

[00:24:38] Erika Bugaj: And maybe that partly was me today thinking it would be so nice to be back on that river instead of having to walk into this crowd of people

[00:24:47] Colleen Long: Yeah.

[00:24:47] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:24:49] Erika Bugaj: on a Monday morning first thing. But you know, that's life.

[00:24:53] Colleen Long: One thing that I have been able to do since the kids were little and I used to try to do date nights, and it was just ridiculous and stupid, but I. Have always allowed the kids to have one night in our room. And I think, you know, some people are like, no, no, no, like no kids in your room. But, um, every other week now they have each have a night, and then that night is their night.

[00:25:20] Colleen Long: They get to take a bath in our fancy bath and they get to like watch a movie and we watch a show together and it's just them and. That has been a really nice hack for me to know, like, we're gonna have that one-on-one time. It's always there and it's at the end of the day, so I can't think anyway, so it's like I put everything down and I can like just connect with them on whatever thing that they're watching.

[00:25:43] Colleen Long: But that has been really good because I think, like you said, Erica, it's like you are ready to connect sometimes and they're doing something completely different, and then you just kind of miss the mark. And so being able to carve that out is. It's sometimes the way to do it.

[00:25:59] Jennifer Politis: That's actually been pretty hard for me recently having two teens. So I have been very creative in my ways of connecting with them because when they were younger, it was great. We could do a date night or we go out to di, you know, the diner with mom, or you rotate who's, who's doing something with you.

[00:26:16] Jennifer Politis: And with a 15-year-old and almost 14-year-old, I have to meet them where they're at, and sometimes that is after my bedtime, late at night when I don't wanna stay up long, you know, longer. But I'm like, you know what? I'm gonna stay up super late and watch this movie with them and I'm gonna get creative.

[00:26:35] Jennifer Politis: And they wanted to go jump on the trampoline at 10:00 PM at night. It's like the last thing that maybe I really wanted to do, but I will go do it because you know, I had an invitation to do it, so I'll take my chance.

[00:26:48] Colleen Long: Oh, that's a, I mean, that's, yeah. That's nice. That's really nice. I don't think I'm that nice. That's great. Yeah, I mean, those are the moments you gotta take when you can. Well, and I don't wanna belabor, I guess the realities of where we're at, but I do think it's important to drive home what a unique time we're in, combined with what a unique field we're in.

[00:27:15] Colleen Long: Right. So like as we're talking, you can already, you can already hear how. different it, it is to, I completely lost my train of thought.

[00:27:25] Colleen Long: Sorry. I got four messages from, uh, soccer and. Then game changer and Izzy's flag football starting tonight and my clinical director can't make our meaning.

[00:27:37] Jennifer Politis: That's a nice tie in.

[00:27:38] Colleen Long: There you

[00:27:39] Erika Bugaj: There you go. That's.

[00:27:40] Colleen Long: Alright. Code shift. What was I talking about? Uh, crushing realities right now. Yeah. So I was, I was, I don't wanna. My, my goal is to not make this about, you know, all doom and gloom.

[00:27:55] Colleen Long: So not to belabor the point about just the realities of where we are, but I think as you guys are talking. Not only do we live in a very bizarre time where post COVID, we're at home and you can work anywhere.

[00:28:11] Colleen Long: That's the good news. The bad news is you can work anywhere and at any time, and so the lines become blurred and there is no off, and there's great technology that's changing every day that allows us to be even more efficient and busy up our time even more. And as parents carrying that mental load and.

[00:28:31] Colleen Long: Practice owners. There's never a day where you check off your box, your, your to-do list, and you go, I'm all done. You know, like it's always there. And so the, the thing that I want to just try to drive home and have people feel maybe seen is that we do live in a, a strange time. And I don't know if this is California or this is the zeitgeist of the time that we're in, but I can't find a babysitter. don't know if it's because the parents are like, don't work right now. I just want you to focus on your studies.

[00:29:12] Colleen Long: I'll just give you money. don't know if it's because kids now can like create a TikTok channel and make millions of dollars. So like, why would you ever babysit for 20 bucks an hour? But like, we can't find help. Um, and so we have it, it takes a village and we don't have a village. We don't even have like, our family helps.

[00:29:34] Colleen Long: So I think that's the other piece is that um, parents are really struggling to find good help, good childcare. And then just the constant child-centric focus that we have now in 2025 of, uh, our kids wanting them. We just want them so badly to have the lives that maybe we didn't have or, or better lives.

[00:30:01] Colleen Long: Right. And so you've got, I mean, at least at our school, we've got donuts with dad, pancakes with pappy, marmalade with mom, like, and it's not like. Come at 5:00 PM it's like 10 to two, and then we'll do an early out What? So it's impossible.

[00:30:21] Jennifer Politis: It is, I'm, I'm actually happy I'm, you know, with my youngest going into middle school in two weeks. I'm out of that elementary zone where everything was during the day.

[00:30:31] Colleen Long: Yeah,

[00:30:32] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:30:33] Colleen Long: yeah, yeah. So I mean, I think you can have it all. But just not all at the same time. And the big key I think for our listeners would be to one, identify what it is you're even doing this for. You know, are you working simply because you think you have to, because you went through school all those years and like you might as well, but you really, your heart is really at home with your kids.

[00:31:06] Colleen Long: And maybe you look at this as a seasonal shift of like maybe you take some time back and focus on them, or is it that you feel pressure from the moms that are more visible at school and you don't see all the working moms, you only see yourself, but yet you love what you do. Like for me, what I do is not work.

[00:31:27] Colleen Long: It's truly I enjoy doing what I'm doing. And so I think identifying. What it is you like first and why you're doing what you're doing. And if you truly are in alignment with the thing that your heart fuels, then giving yourself grace in those parts that you're just not gonna be great at right now. And putting those blinders on.

[00:31:53] Jennifer Politis: Yeah, I agree. And at the end of the day, we just have to be the best mom that we know we can be for our kids, and that's different. And we shouldn't compare ourselves to other moms.

[00:32:02] Colleen Long: Yeah, well, and what a gift it is to your kids to be able to see you, especially if you're like, you know, if the message is, Ugh, I gotta work again today, that, that's not great. But if you're like, I get to do this thing. You know, my kids came in here and they saw this whole setup and they're like, oh, you're recording.

[00:32:21] Colleen Long: Like, that's cool, you know, and they're really excited about that thing and they know I'm really excited about it. And so hopefully that carries into for them that they find something that they're really excited about and, you know, whatever that is. My daughter currently wants to live on a farm and sell eggs, so I don't really know that it's doing its job with her.

[00:32:44] Erika Bugaj: I That sounds great to me.

[00:32:47] Colleen Long: Uh, listen, it sounds very relaxing. I don't know that it's practical in California. I'm like, how are you going to afford to live anywhere?

[00:32:57] Erika Bugaj: Well, I think that's really, it's really healthy for kids to see that you love your work and that you want to do it. And I, I think, I hope that's what my kids see in me as well. Um, and I will sometimes remind them like, you want those ucks, well, mom's gotta work and do her job and you know, you want those good meals.

[00:33:18] Erika Bugaj: I cook. Well, that's from. You know, me going to my practice and doing all the things I do, and they, they get that, they understand it and I think that is helpful and motivating to them too, in terms of developing those skills of self-discipline and, you know, showing up as a worker eventually. Like school's your job right now, this is my job.

[00:33:42] Erika Bugaj: This, we all have to go do our jobs for the day. I think that's, you know, a way of showing up as a mom and uh, work as a therapist at the same time.

[00:33:52] Colleen Long: Mm-hmm. And Erica, to the level of your comfort, but I'm sure your story is helpful for a lot of people. You're, you're a single mom, right? You're going through this thing and you're doing all, I mean, for me, for Jen, we've got help, you know, like. I can't even, Ima, you're in a doctoral program, you're running a business, you've got kids and you're doing this on your own right now.

[00:34:20] Colleen Long: Like are you, do you ever feel like you're on top of life or do you feel like life owns you sometimes?

[00:34:28] Erika Bugaj: Oh well. Yes. I feel like life owns me a lot of the time, but, um, I'm currently on a two week break between semesters, so, um, that's nice.

[00:34:41] Colleen Long: Good.

[00:34:42] Erika Bugaj: I do share custody of my children with their dad, and he fortunately shows up as a parent to them about half the time. So, you know, we really are sharing the, the burden of parenting.

[00:34:58] Erika Bugaj: Equally. Um, you know, I think there's more that we do naturally as moms. Um, but I, I feel fortunate for that. I don't have a lot of family around. You know, it's tough to build a village in 2025,

[00:35:13] Colleen Long: Yeah.

[00:35:14] Jennifer Politis: It is.

[00:35:15] Erika Bugaj: But you know, I have my way of making everything work and sometimes that means doing work while my kids are around.

[00:35:23] Erika Bugaj: And you know, they've made funny observations at times. Like I could tell you're working mom based on the face you're making at your computer, you know? Or like, what are you doing? Is it time for that? And I'm like, yeah, I've gotta, you know, do a few things and then we can go take the dog for a walk together.

[00:35:43] Erika Bugaj: Um, I think it's really finding those, those opportunities in the everyday, the, mundane. Like, my son will like to go take the dog for a walk with me and we'll go shoot some basketballs at the nearby court, you know? Um. It may not be fancy and um, you know, something that I can brag a lot about, but, you know, I fit it in.

[00:36:09] Erika Bugaj: I fit in those times that we have together. Um, I can't really explain how I do it, but I do it. I make it work.

[00:36:18] Colleen Long: Yeah, I have to imagine you're just gonna look back on this and be like, how did I, how did I do that?

[00:36:26] Erika Bugaj: I was thinking like in, you know, 10, 15 years, I'll be sitting, you know, on my couch having a cup of coffee and my kids will be hopefully outta the house or at college and I'll probably be like, huh, I'm so bored. Those were the good times.

[00:36:44] Colleen Long: It is that like this season of life, I think that that has saved me more times than not just remembering like, this is a season. This is a season. And. Had this like moment when I was at Target back to school shopping with Izzy, and she's like changing. And I realized she's 11 at this point. Like she's, she needs a sports s bra, now she's in puberty.

[00:37:11] Colleen Long: And I almost started to cry because I was like, how did I, how did we get here? I felt like I just blacked out like they were babies and now they're here. And we're in the checkout line and there's this mom behind me and she's got three young toddlers and I can just see on her face, she's like, oh my God, just get me through this.

[00:37:32] Colleen Long: The last thing I would ever say to her is, enjoy it. Go spice So quick. You know? But like I, it makes me so sad sometimes it like hurts my stomach how fast and slow things go as a parent. And you know, the day to day can be kind of like grueling, but. I'm like, God, this is such a blip on the radar. And like Erica said, like, we're gonna be sitting in our house, quiet house one day sipping coffee, and the vacuum lines are still there on the carpet.

[00:38:07] Colleen Long: Carpet because our kids haven't messed up anything. And you're like, oh, it the, the silence is palpable.

[00:38:15] Jennifer Politis: Yeah. It's so true though. As they get older, the time I feel like the time is slipping and I used to hate when people would say that to me, but it's so true. I, I'm now thinking of things as like, we only have a few summers left with the oldest one and, you know, it's, it's pretty, pretty wild experience. You wanna hold on as much as you can.

[00:38:36] Colleen Long: I know. I know. The only thing that helps me through all that is realizing everybody struggles with that. At our age, there's no person that's like, man, I'm just like doing it all. I'm just got like, I got it all figured out. My kids are good and my work, my work is good. Uh, I think everybody, especially when you get to, I mean, I'm at 45, right?

[00:38:58] Colleen Long: So like you get to this point where you're like, did I do it right? Am I doing it right? Did I mess this whole thing up? You know, maybe I'm having a little bit of an existential crisis, but that's. The piece I think kids just really bring home for us is like, God, I don't wanna mess this up. And especially not for them.

[00:39:19] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:39:20] Erika Bugaj: these years do go by quickly and um, you know, I think you both just spoke really. Nicely to that. Like they just go by fast and who knows what the next chapters will bring, right?

[00:39:36] Jennifer Politis: Yeah. I think the reality of being a mom boss in mental health is it's messy. It's heavy, it's full of guilt, but it's also full of repair, grace, and growth. So we just have to embrace it.

[00:39:49] Erika Bugaj: Yeah.

[00:39:49] Colleen Long: Well said.

[00:39:50] Erika Bugaj: The repair. The repair aspect is so important. I think,

[00:39:53] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:39:54] Erika Bugaj: you know, both at home and in the practice, like being able to make repair when things don't go optimally or how you would have planned for either your family or, um, the therapists that you work with, right.

[00:40:11] Jennifer Politis: Absolutely. Yeah. I focus on, I love Dr. Becky, but I always take that with me when I'm thinking of something that I'm like, okay, it doesn't need to be perfect. I just need to be present and consistent, but if something goes awry, I just need to repair. Like you said, if it's your business or at home, that's all we can do.

[00:40:32] Colleen Long: I love Dr. Becky.

[00:40:33] Jennifer Politis: Yeah,

[00:40:34] Colleen Long: She's great.

[00:40:36] Jennifer Politis: she is great.

[00:40:37] Colleen Long: well, so what are some things that you guys do? And these can be like either hacks or it can be just sort of tools that you've carried as therapists maybe that have helped you sort of deal with all the stuff that comes with this. You know, like we, we lead an extraordinary life.

[00:40:55] Colleen Long: If you're, if you have scaled a company to seven figures, that is not a simple feat. If you're gonna lead an extraordinary life, it's not realistic to think that extraordinary effort is it linked, linked to that, you know? So you don't get all of that freedom without that responsibility. And so when life is hard and everybody's asking me questions and I get decision fatigue, and I go, why am I, why am I doing this?

[00:41:27] Colleen Long: I feel like this is, I'm making this too hard. I remind myself that. This is not for everybody. And if it were easy, everyone would do it. And so sometimes having a gratitude reset helps me to shift the perspective. And I mean, that's all you know I ever did for 20 years was CBT, cognitive behavioral therapy, right?

[00:41:55] Colleen Long: Shifting perspective, if you can't change the view, change the perspective, and so. It sounds cheesy, but sometimes when I'm so exhausted, I'll think you get to be exhausted. You get to be in a season of life where it's noisy and everybody needs you, and everybody wants to be around you, and you have a very messy, loud house, and some people never got that.

[00:42:22] Colleen Long: You know, some people would kill for that messy, loud house. So what helps you guys reset?

[00:42:29] Jennifer Politis: I think for me it's a mindset. And I will catch myself at times, telling myself the opposite of something. You know, if you're sitting there and you're doing the dishes, instead of complaining and moaning about the dishes, I'm like, I'm so grateful I'm able to do the dishes and have this mound of, you know, we just cooked and had everybody here.

[00:42:50] Jennifer Politis: And so I just try to really, I, I think as therapists too, and psychologists we're. We're really the pros, I think, at the mindset stuff. Like we know everything there is to know in that area, so we just have to practice it and apply it. And of course there's days that that's easier than others. But I do try to really focus on the good and just like you said, the gratitude, like, what's going well?

[00:43:15] Jennifer Politis: And I personally hate when people complain and I hate negative thinking. Um, you know, when you're around someone. So I try to say that to myself in my head. Like, I wouldn't wanna hear myself if I said that out loud, so I have to change it.

[00:43:27] Colleen Long: Yeah.

[00:43:28] Jennifer Politis: How about you, Erica?

[00:43:29] Erika Bugaj: I think for me it, I, I really appreciate what you just shared, Jen. Um, I think that fits with like, so much of life being in the mundane, you know, the washing, the dishes, the running the loads of laundry, you know, dumping all the laundry on the bed and folding it. Um, but I think my grounding or my way of resetting is.

[00:43:53] Erika Bugaj: Being outside often. You know, I mentioned taking the dog for a walk, whether it's me, solo, or with one or two kids. You know, I think taking the dog for a walk is a nice way of grounding and connecting to what's around you. Um. I happen to live like on the edge of a big park in dc and another favorite thing to do is use, uh, the Merlin app.

[00:44:20] Erika Bugaj: I don't know if you've heard of it, but it's a, it's a bird watching app, so if you download it, you can hit the record button and it picks up all the bird songs around you. So you can, yeah, you can, you can see what birds you're hearing in real time, and. Sometimes I'll put that on in the backyard or on a walk and just kind of marvel at all the different birds and wildlife around me.

[00:44:51] Erika Bugaj: Um, but I think that also comes from having been trained as a nature informed therapist. There are so many aspects of nature that can ground us and, and, you know, reorient us when we feel stressed or overwhelmed. So that really works well for me.

[00:45:09] Jennifer Politis: For me, I love the sun. I feel like, and even in the winter time if I, I try to walk up at sunrise, take a walk, and for me, that just resets everything for me.

[00:45:19] Erika Bugaj: I think we've, you know, sort of separated ourselves from those natural rhythms of life and the planet with all of our technology. So, you know, tuning yourself into the rising of the sun and the setting of the sun can be extremely grounding as well. I like that.

[00:45:39] Colleen Long: It reminds me of that meme that you see going around. Like one day you're in a field dying from alcohol poisoning, and the next, you're wondering if that's a marble headed warbler.

[00:45:48] Erika Bugaj: That sounds fitting.

[00:45:50] Colleen Long: I, I actually have one of those bird, I forget what it's called. It's like a bird feeder, but it's an ai, so it, it's like, oh, you have a, a, a house finch that's stopped by to say hello and you can press it, and it sh it's like a video of a finch on your bird feeder. And you get to like see all these different birds that have stopped by.

[00:46:13] Erika Bugaj: Ooh, that's

[00:46:13] Colleen Long: fascinating. Yeah.

[00:46:15] Erika Bugaj: I need one of those.

[00:46:17] Colleen Long: It's so neat. Bird buddy. That's what it's called. Bird buddy.

[00:46:21] Erika Bugaj: bird buddy.

[00:46:22] Colleen Long: Yeah. But I agree with you guys like, I mean, there's gotta be, I mean, Eastern Medicine talks about QI and how it's realigned when you get into nature and more and more as we get older, all my friends. I'm like, what do you do right now for exercise?

[00:46:39] Colleen Long: And they're like, I just go on a nature walk. I'm like, yes. The nature walk. It's underrated.

[00:46:44] Jennifer Politis: Yeah.

[00:46:45] Colleen Long: Yeah, it does it. It's a nice reset. Alright, well, so if today showed us anything, it's that being a mom boss isn't about balance. It's about constant pivots. Some days you're a CEO, some days you're a chauffeur. Some days you're just trying to keep the wifi working long enough to survive a Zoom call.

[00:47:04] Erika Bugaj: True.

[00:47:05] Colleen Long: So we wanna hear from you guys. What's one thing that you're letting go of this season? Um, you can find us at Off the Chair podcast on Instagram, and you could also DM us or drop it in the comments so we can share. Let us know what's one thing you're letting go of this season. We wanna share and normalize this together because none of us are doing it all, and that's the point.

[00:47:31] Jennifer Politis: So see you guys next time.

[00:47:34] Colleen Long: All right.

[00:47:35] Erika Bugaj: Bye for now.

Off the Chair Podcast

The Realities of Being a Mom Boss

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Colleen Long, Psy.D.

Jennifer Politis, PhD, LPC

Erika Bugaj, MA, MSW, LICSW

Episode Transcript:

Scale, Sell, or Stay: How to Know What’s Next for Your Practice